Election Discussions - National, State etc

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Vikas
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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Vikas » Mon May 21, 2018 5:40 am

^^ Not every NOTA is a vote for BJP.


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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Sachin » Mon May 21, 2018 10:09 am

x-posted from Politics thread..
Sachin wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 10:08 am
Mean while, poor D.K Shivakumar had to swallow the bitterness and ally with JD(S); hope things improve for him.
Strong opponent of JD(S) but had to swallow bitterness: Congress’ point person DK Shivakumar for alliance
A DAY after BJP leader B S Yeddyurappa resigned as Karnataka Chief Minister, paving the way for a Congress-JD(S) government, Congress leader D K Shivakumar, considered the architect behind the operation to keep the alliance MLAs together, said he was a “strong opponent” of the JD(S), but had swallowed some “bitterness” since all opposition parties were uniting against the BJP.
Swallowing the bitterness - Live ;).

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Primus » Mon May 21, 2018 11:42 am

SSundar wrote:
Sun May 20, 2018 11:02 pm
..............
There is also another (rather large) segment - Hindus who have close friends or significant others among the Peacefuls and Lovefuls.
..............
This is a particular problem outside of India. So many family members have close friends among the Indian diaspora who are one of the above. It is impossible to discuss anything related to India or the BJP without them parroting the usual canards against Modi or India. I don't get into an argument with them except sometimes the lies are so blatant that I feel compelled to intervene.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by MehtaRahulC » Mon May 21, 2018 11:56 am

JohnTitor wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 3:18 am
^^ To accuse RSS of being anti-national is one thing, but now you are suggesting that they control CBI and IT? What next, do they have hold over the CIA and MI6??

Mehta sir, some of what you say holds true and I feel you have the right intensions but by claiming such improbable things you are just diminishing your credibility. I would urge you to keep it same and do what you can instead of coming up with irrational conspiracy theories
Its my personal belief that RSS and BJP are one and same. Just as many in India believe that Gangadhar and Shaktimaan are same.

And BJP legally (and in ethically right away) controls CBI, income tax dept via Ministers who are RSS = BJP MPs. Just as elected politicians across world control various depts in govts. Whether they misuse it for political purpose is 70 year old story of India or rather 10000 year old story of whole mankind.

So imo there is NOTHING illegal or unethical about RSS = BJP controlling CBI, income tax , excise, ED etc.

Now whether RSS = BJP Ministers use or misuse this LEGAL control over CBI etc to poach others' MLAs and keep their MLAs in line is anybody's guess.

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^^ Not every NOTA is a vote for BJP.
Every party leader , party worker and even every independent (except myself) these days claims that "if there was no NOTA, then I would have got all NOTA votes" !!!

Gus
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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Gus » Mon May 21, 2018 1:55 pm

Vikas wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 5:40 am
^^ Not every NOTA is a vote for BJP.
correct, but it would be at least illuminating to know that if they were outright congress votes - then the bjp will know what to do. this NOTA is a stupid thing.

ideally people should be allowed to vote first preference and second preference and have run-off elections to get true preferred representative. having a first part post, and NOTA does not make sense.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Suraj » Mon May 21, 2018 2:19 pm

Supratik wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 7:16 pm
Core voters will usually stay home if they are unhappy. NOTA voters will be more AAPian types or fence-sitters.
The ones who choose to stay home by definition are not core voters .

The ruling party has the first parliamentary majority in a generation . It rules 2/3rds of the states and over 90% of the GDP . The opposition has a certifiable imbecile as its party president . Do their core voters stay home the last three years ?

The job of a core voter is to penetrate the policy levels of the party and influence them to prioritize their favored actions. The ones who sit home and sulk aren’t core voters . They can pretend they are, but good luck convincing anyone .

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by MehtaRahulC » Tue May 22, 2018 2:49 am

The ones who choose to stay home by definition are not core voters .

The ruling party has the first parliamentary majority in a generation . It rules 2/3rds of the states and over 90% of the GDP . The opposition has a certifiable imbecile as its party president . Do their core voters stay home the last three years ?

The job of a core voter is to penetrate the policy levels of the party and influence them to prioritize their favored actions. The ones who sit home and sulk aren’t core voters . They can pretend they are, but good luck convincing anyone .
Previously, task given to core supporters was "bring voters to RSS = BJP, make RSS MLA/MP candidates win, and RSS = BJP MPs will solve will solve all problems". And now that RSS candidates are MPs and MLAs, workload increased to "your bringing voters is not enough ; pls spend time inside rss = bjp to influence policy making as well " !!! So workload will keep on increasing.

Well, imo what core voters should do depends on what core voters want. If goal of core voters is to ensure ONLY electoral victories for RSS = BJP (or whatever party), then they can very well confine to prachar = propaganda of their master party.

But if goal of core voters is to bring some core changes in govt and in India, like ending govt control over temples, save small/medium private non-missionary schools, ensure that economy is NOT hijacked by usuk-elitemen via FDI, ending cow slaughter etc then these core voters imo should NOT waste their time in prachar = propaganda of RSS = BJP and also not waste time in penetrating into RSS = BJP and try to influence law-making or policy making. Because law-drafts and policies in congress/rss/aap/cpm etc are decided by apex desi-videshi elitemen only, and even elected MPs have no say. So if any common man works to "penetrate the policy levels of the party and influence them to prioritize their favored actions", then he will be ONLY wasting his time.
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Instead, he should work to create a TRUE nationalist, TRUE secular, TRUE non-anti-Hindu, true swadeshi and true anti-corruption POLITICAL PARTY, which can become alternative to psuedos. congress/rss/aap

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by sbajwa » Wed May 23, 2018 1:31 pm

What Indian election commission needs to do is mandatory elections inside each party to pick up candidate for each constituency. Just like primaries in USA about 3 months before general elections. Even better than USA that all general population can vote in any party for any candidate. That is the only way to stop dynastic politics.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by MehtaRahulC » Wed May 23, 2018 2:06 pm

What Indian election commission needs to do is mandatory elections inside each party to pick up candidate for each constituency. Just like primaries in USA about 3 months before general elections. Even better than USA that all general population can vote in any party for any candidate. That is the only way to stop dynastic politics.
Primaries are not compulsory in USA. It depends on party's own constitution. USA allows political parties to have heriditary structure, if a party wants.

In USA, major parties's apex have become complete slaves of us-elitemen. The bottom / middle is still free from elitmen's control due multi-election i.e. some 5 to 20 district level and some 5 to 10 state level officials are directly elected by voters. eg Police Commissioner aka sheriff in USA is directly elected by commons, and so is district judges, district public prosecutors etc. IOW, heriditary structure in US polity is less because of MULTI-ELECTIONS, not because of some rule that "parties must have primaries", because no such rules exist.

Also, hereditary transfer of in US economy was low due to wealth tax and inheritance tax. When economic ownership of land, minerals, banks etc has less hereditary transfer, the hereditary appointment in polity is less. It is NON MERITORIOUS hereditary transfer of wealth which spawns hereditary transfer of positions in

But as domination of Fraudation (aka Foundations) in economy increases, wealth tax , inheritance tax and even income tax on many wealth/income is reducing to near zero in USA. So heriditary transfer of wealth is increasing. So nepotism in polity at apex levels in increasing.

Allowing election commission to control political party will only worsen polity in India. Because most Election Commission officials are corrupt and they will only use their additional powers to further benefit the desi elitemen and videshi elitemen.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Vikas » Wed May 23, 2018 3:02 pm

A voter making an effort to go all the way to the polling booth and then pressing NOTA is such a waste knowing that NOTA will not change the result.
Actually In a sadistic way, I am glad that BJP lost the KA election by a whisker. The heart burn that BJP supporters will get may inspire them to go out and vote in the next election across states. Also the fact that every party would come together to stop BJP will add further anguish to those who still think that elections offer fair playground to all and that voting for any other party is akin to voting for Congress via backdoor. Add minorities openly calling for defeat of Hindus may and just may light the spark that is still missing for mass mobilization of Hindus.
RJ and CH elections will be good barometer of this hypothesis of mine.

Vikas
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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Vikas » Wed May 23, 2018 3:05 pm

sbajwa wrote:
Wed May 23, 2018 1:31 pm
What Indian election commission needs to do is mandatory elections inside each party to pick up candidate for each constituency. Just like primaries in USA about 3 months before general elections. Even better than USA that all general population can vote in any party for any candidate. That is the only way to stop dynastic politics.
BajwaJi, USA IMO is a bad example to follow. How would that stop dynastic politics when like of Scindia family or MSY family are yet to loose any elections.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Gus » Wed May 23, 2018 3:09 pm

primaries are not constitutional requirements in US. it is internal process. you cannot fit it into indian electoral mechanism.

there are enough laws that need to be enforced first. processing all the cases quickly and decisively would itself disbar many corrupt regional party leaders and would lead to their waning and eventual demise.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Vikas » Wed May 23, 2018 3:28 pm

Starting with the queen bee and her Robot...

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by sbajwa » Wed May 23, 2018 5:50 pm

Most of the parties have no internal election and some dynastic leader at top appoint candidates. A candidate must be a popular leader of the area.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by MehtaRahulC » Thu May 24, 2018 6:40 am

sbajwa: Most of the parties have no internal election and some dynastic leader at top appoint candidates. A candidate must be a popular leader of the area.
There is NO law in USA which requires all parties to have a primary. The parties' own choice to have primary and they may even have other means. What you are suggesting is --- print a law that will empower (highly corrupt) ECI officials to FORCE all political parties to have inner primaries !!! IOW, your proposed law will ruin leftover of goodness in small political parties.

Nevertheless, have you uploaded the law you propose on newindia dot in?

If yes, can you put the link to the law-draft you have proposed which will empower (corrupt) ECI officials to force all parties to have primaries?

If not, can you upload it asap?

(newindia dot in is a central govt website, part of PM's newindia initiative)
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--------------------
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Dynasty in politics is symptom of dynastic or hidden dysnastic raaj in economy . USA weaken dynastic transfer of wealth by wealth tax and inheritance tax.

RSS = RSS + BJP doesnt have dysnatic raaj because RSS forced a rule that middle/apex members must remain unmarried and childless, and must cut off ties with brothers, sisters and other family members. This was viable as long as (RSS = RSS + BJP) was small in size. Now it has grown, so they need so many people, and not all are willing to remain unmarried, childless, cut ties with families. So they are allowing married with children people, and all of them are pushing their children's career. Once NaMo leaves PM position in 2024, BJP will become same nepotic hell hole as congress.
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Another possibility is that congress/rss/aap will be COMPLETELY taken over by usuk-elitemen, and so apex leaders will have NO say on who will be next apex or middle leaders !! And so nepotism will disappear !! Surely, thats not a good solution

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Raju » Sat May 26, 2018 4:56 am

sbajwa wrote:
Wed May 23, 2018 5:50 pm
Most of the parties have no internal election and some dynastic leader at top appoint candidates. A candidate must be a popular leader of the area.
did you watch the democratic primary of hillary's nomination and how she beat Sen. bernie sanders. There was nothing democratic it.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by BhairavP » Tue May 29, 2018 7:29 am

Kairana seems to be going to the United Opposition.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Sachin » Wed May 30, 2018 5:59 am

BhairavP wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 7:29 am
Kairana seems to be going to the United Opposition.
Any links? The counting is not today, am I right?

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Nandu » Wed May 30, 2018 8:13 am

Sachin wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 5:59 am
BhairavP wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 7:29 am
Kairana seems to be going to the United Opposition.
Any links? The counting is not today, am I right?
It is tomorrow.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by crams » Wed May 30, 2018 11:54 pm

BhairavP wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 7:29 am
Kairana seems to be going to the United Opposition.
Thats baad news. Is this your opinion or anything supporting this conclusion.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Raju » Thu May 31, 2018 5:42 am

10p hike per day will give bjp simple majority in 2019.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by Sachin » Thu May 31, 2018 6:10 am


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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by abhijit » Thu May 31, 2018 6:32 am

Troubles for BJP.

And they have distanced some powerful allies. Election is about math and it's going to be tough.

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Re: Election Discussions - National, State etc

Post by darshhan » Thu May 31, 2018 7:45 am

BhairavP wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 7:29 am
Kairana seems to be going to the United Opposition.
There is a silver lining in kairana bypoll trends. The turnout was only 54%. When BJP won this seat in 2014, the turnout was about 73% and BJP candidate Shri Hukum Singh won actually more than 50% of the recorded votes.

The most important thing for BJP in UP is to focus on getting more people to vote in 2019. Lack of focus and energy on the part of hindu voters on election day will be main enemy of BJP, not SP-BSP combine.

BJP cadre should be targeting 85% turnout in 2019. That means mobilisation on steroids.

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