The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

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hanumadu
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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by hanumadu » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:03 pm

Zynda wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:50 pm
OK folks. It seems like Karnataka wing of IYC, the youth arm of INC is doing door-door campaign in Karnataka about NaMo's failure. I think they are scheduled to be some where near my house in the next two weeks. I think some of their documents contain following content wrt Rafale scam, recent events with TSP (highlighting UPA's decision on upgrading IAF fighters) etc. I am pasting some info here. Would appreciate if folks could come up with points on countering the same
Congress deal was to get
- 126 Rafales (what IAF wants)
- Made in India by HAL
- Cheaper rate per jet

Modi cancelled that in 2016 for
- 36 Rafales only
- Made with Ambani
- Costlier rate per jet

Who bought & upgraded the Mirage 2000?
Who bought & upgraded the MiG-29?
Who bought the Su-30?
Who upgraded the MiG-21, enabling it to shoot down an F-16?
Congress.

Who turned down a French offer for the Mirage 2000 assembly line?
BJP.
Some of them are obvious like cheaper rate per jet (for people like follow defence news closely) but it would be nice if we could come up with bullet points rebuttal on some of the more complex issues (like 36 Rafale jets instead of 126) etc.
On why only 36, Congress could not buy even one and said there was no money. So how can BJP buy 126 in one go? Here are screen shots of AK Anthony and Chidambaram saying there is no money to buy them both in 2013 and 2014.

Image
Image

On other purchases, it was their duty as incumbent govt to buy them. Why did the squadron strength decrease to below 40 against a requirement of above 50 if they were buying all those planes? They bought very few planes during a long period of rule. Why did we even have to upgrade Mig 21, a 60 year old plane, instead of buying newer ones?

As per cheaper rate, Qatar and Egypt bought Rafales and the same or higher price than India. Are the french Rahul Gandhi's sasural that they are going to give them cheaper?

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by SSundar » Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:10 am

Sachin wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 2:48 pm
Does any one have the same feelings like me? That Hon.SC is being a given a very long rope to hang? May be it was only in the last five years that judicial system in India has been on the limelight (and often for wrong reasons). Generally people never used to complain/question verdicts coming from Hon.SC. Now there is at least quite a strong murmur questioning the integrity of the judiciary as well as the appointment system followed (Collegium et.al).
I used to hate this Modi way of working slow but have to grudgingly accept that he is onto something here. Until 2014, I used to think that individual judges across India may be corrupt but the Supreme Court as an institution maintains its integrity. This stands thoroughly exposed in the 5 years of Modi. He will probably let this simmer for a few more years before everyone and his uncle will be screaming for a total judicial reform.

Only problem is the Viraat Yindoo screaming for removal of Modi before that because Modi is not Yindoo enough.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by SSundar » Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:14 am

Zynda wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:50 pm
OK folks. It seems like Karnataka wing of IYC, the youth arm of INC is doing door-door campaign in Karnataka about NaMo's failure. I think they are scheduled to be some where near my house in the next two weeks. I think some of their documents contain following content wrt Rafale scam, recent events with TSP (highlighting UPA's decision on upgrading IAF fighters) etc. I am pasting some info here. Would appreciate if folks could come up with points on countering the same
Your response: "Oh I really didn't know. Modi is very bad. If you show me a copy of the order for 126 planes signed by AK Antony and Manmohan Singh, I will vote for Congress".

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by JohnTitor » Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:57 am

SSundar wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:14 am
Zynda wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:50 pm
OK folks. It seems like Karnataka wing of IYC, the youth arm of INC is doing door-door campaign in Karnataka about NaMo's failure. I think they are scheduled to be some where near my house in the next two weeks. I think some of their documents contain following content wrt Rafale scam, recent events with TSP (highlighting UPA's decision on upgrading IAF fighters) etc. I am pasting some info here. Would appreciate if folks could come up with points on countering the same
Your response: "Oh I really didn't know. Modi is very bad. If you show me a copy of the order for 126 planes signed by AK Antony and Manmohan Singh, I will vote for Congress".
Don't bother with a logical response, rather depending on if the person is genuinely uneducated or is just peddling lies.

If the former, then go ahead and explain. Otherwise, go the other way. Tell them how BJP has ruined your way of getting a lot of bribes and you want INC back so that you can grow your fortune, country be damned because I will emigrate to a developed country.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by Muns » Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:24 am

Guys, for what it's worth, I've written article regarding the recent Supreme Court judgment on the Babri Masjid. It has somewhat of an American flair, but I think on a different angle of attack that maybe hasn't been done before. What we can try to use, is the Babri Masjid as a symbol. A symbol of tyranny and of subjugation on the historical meme. I've tried to use the Babri Masjid as a symbol of the terrible effects of conquest of the Islamic reads and rule leading to the what can only be described as genocide en masse of Hindus during the period of 4 to 5 centuries. If we can see the Babri Masjid, as merely a symbol representing the cruelty of the Hindu genocide that existed during this time, and there is plenty of evidence to support this, then maybe we can represent different form of angle of attack.

In any case, take a look at my reasoning here and let me know.

Babri Masjid, a symbol of past tyranny?

https://www.india-aware.com/featured/ba ... t-tyranny/
To a vast section of Americans these statues still remind many of the horrible days that black Americans had to endure under slavery. The pain and cry of many of these black Americans who lived as second-class citizens, who could never vote and to a great extent were abused both physically and mentally, now cry out against many of these symbols that remind them of their horrors passed.

These statues have been systematically removed and a sense of justice is finally being set in place as the symbols of slavery are soon being relegated to museums and out of national cities.
Such a symbol of tyranny, and slavery causing tremendous pain to millions of Hindus with its very foundations built over the destruction of a peaceful religious ideology…Should be left well alone, allowing the correction of history to write itself with now the building back of the Ram Janmabhoomi Mandir.

It has been done before, such as Somnath where an equally gruesome historical precedent serves.

Symbols are meant to inspire. For many of us they are meant to breed creativity and ensure vitality to further the progress of humanity. Symbols that serve as painful reminders of destruction and slavery should be well removed from the Indian landscape.

The Supreme Court in its most recent judgment seems to have kicked the football yet again towards another mediation party.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by chetak » Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:31 am

Image

Zynda
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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by Zynda » Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:32 am

Thanks all...the responses are not for me. I will just tell these IYC folks to buzz offf...was thinking more for general public where some BJP IT cell person can tweet these responses. BTW, I found the bullet point IYC statement on Twitter itself.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by srikumar » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:57 am

Zynda wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:32 am
Thanks all...the responses are not for me. I will just tell these IYC folks to buzz offf...was thinking more for general public where some BJP IT cell person can tweet these responses. BTW, I found the bullet point IYC statement on Twitter itself.
way you go.😀. I was going to say you the exact same thing .....to not waste your time on these fools (or corrupt people, if they are not fools and actually know better about the party they are supporting). It is worth your time only when the other person is relatively neutral or atleast willing to hear what you say.

The only value I see in engaging the IYC people are if you want to know i) what their arguments are, or ii) what are their counters to your rebuttals. Other than this, it is worse than a waste if time....it can affect your health and peace of mind e.g. increase your BP levels like crams 😀. Not kidding.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by syam » Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:46 pm

Image

KL Dubey
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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by KL Dubey » Sun Mar 10, 2019 3:08 pm

Two latest polls are out.

Republic/CVoter: NDA 264/UPA 141

Zee News: NDA 264/UPA 165

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Indi ... on_polling

(The CVoter poll is not yet shown in Wikipedia).

For comparison, the polls of 2014:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_p ... l_election

Main points:

- We can now see a definite and remarkable uptick in March. The Jan-Feb polls were giving NDA a range of 225-252.

- In March 2014 the polls were showing at the NDA 230-246 range in compared to 211-236 in Jan-Feb 2014.

- After VDP, the CVoter guys are the second agency to do a repeat poll in 2019. They went from 233 in Jan 2019 ---> 264 in March 2019.

- It looks like there is a 2019 NaMo wave on the rise! I am sure Amit and NaMo will be working to ensure it peaks in the election season.

- Don't wanna jinx nothin', but it looks to me that the only question of interest at this point is whether BJP will cross 272 on its own (I believe YES with good reason, not just wishes and prayaz). With the excellent work done in 5 years, the nationalist wave, the smart alliances, Amit at the helm of NDA, and Pres. RN Kovind in place for any rearguard action needed on May 23, it is virtually certain that NDA-3 will happen and NaMo will renew his contract with da peeps of India.

- Still there is NO ROOM for complacency. Miles to go and no sleeping.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by Pratyush » Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:13 pm

We need dilbu in this thread.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by Mort Walker » Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:33 pm

I would say let the president of India repeal Article 35A of the constitution on the grounds that it is discriminatory toward women. The SC will stay the president's decision, it will then become a political benchmark for the electorate to see who is for India and who is against.

chetak
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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by chetak » Sun Mar 10, 2019 6:13 pm

Mort Walker wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:33 pm
I would say let the president of India repeal Article 35A of the constitution on the grounds that it is discriminatory toward women. The SC will stay the president's decision, it will then become a political benchmark for the electorate to see who is for India and who is against.
If push comes to shove, the GoI should legislate their way out of this imbroglio, after the stay, of course.

There are too many pakis embedded deep within the political and other related ecosystems for this challenge to pass unanswered.

These ecosystems should be publicly shown up and shamed for the traitors that they are.

They have wilfully stymied the system since 1947 onwards with impunity with paki pakis directly calling the show via the lootyens gang. Just look at how the enemy property act was held off for so many decades until it was finally passed by the Modi govt. paki pakis had a direct interest in not allowing that legislation to be passed.

Jammu and ladkh should be hived off as separate UTs, administered directly from dilli with the IA enforcing security at govt level and the police very firmly under it, and not being allowed to wag their tails.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by abhijit » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:05 am

Lot depending on turnout. fingers crossed.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by chinmayanand » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:16 pm

10% reservation quota + hitting bajwa-e-behind + ayushman bharat ARE the main things done by NaMo to bring back disenchanted voters to BJP . It's NaMo NaMo again. Not to lose heart . I think in UP ,BJP may hit 50 plus .

SC/ST voters do not like this alliance with SP. I think in majority of seats where SP candidates will be fielded , dalit voters will vote BJP. These guys maybe poor and backward , but they are mentally bright enough to know who to vote for.

I hear Bahanji selling a ticket for 25 crores. So , she ain't taking any chances either. She will have enough money from ticket sale itself.

I think small traders who had become anti-BJP because of GST and demonetization , are back into the tent . Modi ,indeed, knows how to connect to the masses . After Pulwama attack , he was deeply touched. He indeed felt what the mango indians wanted and delivered it . He is not going to lose 2019 come what may .

Mission 350 plus. One sone pe suhaga thing is the Seculars farting with their mouths asking for Saboot , now Masood Azhar ji. Everyday seculars are touching new lows .
Public is watching and will reply soon at the booth.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by VinodTK » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:45 pm

India-Pakistan escalation gives edge to Modi in re-election bid
Quote "The frontrunner, even before the terrorist attack and the Indian response to it, was the ruling Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) of Prime Minister Narendra Modi. Post-Pulwama, though there have been no tracking polls published till now, Modi’s position is thought to have strengthened further.

The BJP has already recalibrated its campaign to champion, as a senior party leader told Asia News Network, “the Prime Minister’s bold, decisive, take-no-prisoners attitude” when it comes to acting against Pakistan-based terrorists.

National security, the long-delayed procurement of Rafale fighter jets pushed through by Modi (which the Opposition has alleged stinks of a scam) and building India’s military prowess to match its economic heft are key themes.

Most analysts including those opposed to the BJP concede that Modi is likely to gain from the stand-off with Pakistan as the party will run a presidential, personality-centric campaign on various platforms including social media."
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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by JohnTitor » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:40 am

While I agree with the assessment that pulwama has bettered NMs odds, I think he should be very careful and not complacent. Not only on the politics side, but on terrorism.

Congoons might ask their buddies across the border to try something bigger to make Modi look bad.

This is where we are at now. Opposition parties supporting mortal enemies for the sale of power and winning elections.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by Nandu » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:01 am

Paging Niran of BRF fame from 2014 days! His on ground reports from UP and elsewhere was so informative. And of course Dilbu's jinx busting posts.

JohnTitor
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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by JohnTitor » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:09 pm

Dilbu jinx doesn't work. Last time he tried was not effective

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by tajmahal321 » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:57 pm

Opinion polls are very unpredictable. Below is the average of all the opinion polls released last few days.

Polling agency NDA UPA Others

News Nation 270 134 139
VDP Associates 291 120 132
ABPNewsCvoter 264 141 138
IndiaTV-CNX 285 126 132
Zee 24 Taas 264 165 114

Average of the above five opinion polls
NDA 275
UPA 137
Others 131


Data gathered from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_p ... l_election

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by Zynda » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:11 pm

Most reports on jobs/unemployment paint a gloomy picture in India. Unemployment rate is growing in India and most seem to say that it has worsened in the last 2-3 years. It is true that India has had a joblessness growth for a long time (even since UPA). Again, I see opposition parties hammering unemployment at each & every fora as much as possible. Was watching Times Now debate and the BJP representative was not making good arguments. The only reasonable argument he made was pointing it out the economic mess that India was in immediately post-2014, but it is true that common man on street does not care about excuses but is rather looking forward to solutions for this job situation from all parties.

I am not very well informed, but is there any road map released by BJP on how they plan to improve unemployment situation?

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by SSundar » Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:24 pm

JohnTitor wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:40 am
Congoons might ask their buddies across the border to try something bigger to make Modi look bad.

This is where we are at now. Opposition parties supporting mortal enemies for the sale of power and winning elections.
There are those who believe that Pulwama itself was exactly that.
Rumors floated around Twitter that a young lady had met with Pakis in Dubai as soon as she was "launched" and asked for something big to discredit Modi. Pulwama happened within weeks.

The first reactions after Pulwama were interesting. Congis were on all channels asking "my PM" to retaliate hard and now. There was also a lot of noise about RaGa and PV cancelling their meetings while Modi and Shah were still carrying on with their own meetings even after the attack news reached them.

If Modi had NOT attacked until the code of conduct went into effect, he might have been painted as a coward. If he had sent in special forces, Pakis may have been well-prepared to give him a bloody nose. Would have been a lose-lose situation for him.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by crams » Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:51 pm

Zynda, I am not saying you are doing it, but playing with #s as BJP is doing, or as Congoons and their PR mouthpieces like that clown Sreenivasan Jain do is ultimate sophistry. I mean unemployment situation in India has always been bad. Its just that like 24-hour news cycle and minute by minute reporting, these days, one can use western, modern techniques and superimpose in Indian context and come up with some useless conclusions. The point is that ModiJi is trying to fix the economy ground up. There is no magic bullet to make things hunky dory after 70+ years of mess.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by ashokk » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:20 pm

Twitter executives could face 7-year jail, warns government
NEW DELHI: The government has warned Twitter that its top executives could face up to seven years in jail along with financial penalties for their failure to remove content and accounts carrying "objectionable and inflammatory content".

A failure to remove this content or inordinate delays in complying with the government's request are seen to be a violation of the country's IT laws, sources told TOI. "We seek compliance, and they have also started agreeing in certain cases. However, in many cases they do remain unresponsive," a government official said.

The warning from the ministry of information technology, which follows 'clearance from the top echelons' within the government, comes just as the global micro-blogging giant faced the heat from a parliamentary standing committee over perceived biases in blocking accounts ahead of the general election. :twisted: And much against the committee's wish, Twitter founder Jack Dorsey could not be present for the panel's questioning.

The government now says that the company has been asked to abide by the law, or else action will follow.

Twitter has been "warned and asked to comply with the provisions under the Indian IT Act. Otherwise, it will face action under Section 69A of the IT Act. A notice has been sent in this regard", senior government officials, on condition of anonymity, told TOI. Section 69A of the IT Act gives powers to the government to seek the blocking of content or accounts which carry information that is seen as detrimental to the sovereignty and integrity of the country, or has the potential to create public disorder. The Act says that any intermediary (internet platform) who fails to comply with the direction "shall be punished with an imprisonment for a term which may extend to seven years and shall also be liable to fine".


A detailed questionnaire sent to Twitter officials on the matter remained unanswered at the time of going to print. As the country approaches national elections, the government has asked social-media and internet giants such as Twitter, Facebook and WhatsApp to ensure that their platforms are not used to undermine or influence the political process.


The issue has also been flagged by IT and law minister Ravi Shankar Prasad, who has warned of strict action against any internet company whose platform is misused for spreading fake news and other kinds of misinformation. The issue had assumed significance after the Facebook-Cambridge Analytica data leak and political meddling episode came to the fore, while fake and viral messages on WhatsApp were blamed for a series of lynching incidents across the country.

The government is in the process of updating the IT laws to bring internet companies under the ambit of Indian laws, and also prompt a faster response time from them. The draft IT [Intermediaries Guidelines (Amendment) Rules], 2018 proposes that any online company that has more than 50 lakh users in India should be incorporated within the country, have a permanent registered office and appoint a nodal person of contact.


It also says that when asked through a lawful order, the intermediary (internet company) should, within 72 hours of communication, provide information and assistance to government agencies. These should be done in cases related to the country's security or cyber security; or during investigation or detection or prosecution or prevention of an offence.

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Re: The Great Indian Political Drama - 3 (Oct 2018 - )

Post by tajmahal321 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:12 am

Kerala CEC banned discussing of Sabrimala issue by candidates few days back and now retracted it by saying it can be discussed as a "social issue"(link below). This is becoming comical.What is next for CEC?don't bring terrorist attacks as an issue for election.

BJP don't have much chances in Kerala's 20 lok sabha seats because of demographic changes happening in the state for last several decades. Hindus are only close to 50% or even less than 50% in 18-19 of the 20 seats. Trivandrum is the best chance for BJP with 65% Hindu population. BJP is hoping to open the first account here. But left party may secretly support Tharoor to prevent that. Trivandrum seat has become a high profile one because of this tight contest. Last time Tharoor won by margin of only 15000 while in 2009 he won by a landslide margin of more than 1 lakh vote.

https://english.manoramaonline.com/in-d ... paign.html

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